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X-Wing Pilot Belts

 
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Jerrick Sunrunner (Mark Mulcaster)
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 4:08 pm    Post subject: X-Wing Pilot Belts Reply with quote

I wanted to raise this as a concern and possible suggestion for either an amendment or addition to the current X-wing Standards.

Whilst looking at a New Hope in UHD there is a distinct variation between the the main belt material (which should match the harness) and belt flare holders.
On inspection of the Identities X-Wing pilto costume we can see two different materials in use.
The main belt has the straight lines where as the flare holders use the herring bone material.
This herring bone material is a shade darker than the grey of the belt

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1OBUimNePLWsBgpkIKQxPuVlfaXePz1AX
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1fjBM6EHHwx7gP3n745jtoI_TTGyr8iCw

https://drive.google.com/open?id=14-pBciO0cwErL277Sa4gEhAgidiuV-jz

https://drive.google.com/open?id=12AQar2xtuKd_xfS7itYFNq0ef7_mWP2J
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1OWfiTf2alvIUF-lesfBAI06Jabg7mA7Z

Heres also Wedge from ROTJ:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1WKeTg5i_MuCje_kih_IZn4-VDzHjYoVQ

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0MdGqHrpa2QKCK8FNtwEE5qUE3ow7-j
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is certainly an interesting detail to notice now that we have access to Ultra High Resolution images of the film.
I am just curious. What is the amendment or addition that you propose making to the current standards?

Would you prefer that everyone submitting a pilot costume have herringbone webbing of a slightly darker shade, used to make the flare holder?

We know that much of the materials used in the films (particularly ANH) were surplus materials that they sourced from local military and other sources.
They took whatever was available to them at the time to make the film.

In my opinion, Adding such a detail to the current standard could really complicate people getting their costume approved over such a minor detail that most people would never notice.

Where would we find a herringbone webbing of the correct width that is a slightly darker shade from the webbing we normally use to make the belt and ejection harness?

As a part vendor myself, I try my best to make the items that I offer as screen accurate as I possibly can, however, finding accurate materials that are the correct sizes and colors can be a very difficult task.

I make pilot chest boxes and I know that the neck strap on the screen used chest boxes were made of cotton. The webbing used also has a certain look to it with the way that it is woven together. This is what I seek out when I try to source my supplies. However, I very rarely find webbing that has the ideal look and color to what is seen on screen.
Like they did for the film, I often have to take what is available to finish the chest boxes, even though the webbing is not a perfect match to what is on screen.

Notice what the current standard says about the chest box strap:

Quote:
Chest box is secured around the collar and the back with olive drab nylon/polypropylene/polyester/cotton(canvas) straps.


That certainly leaves things rather vague and open to a variety of possibilities!
(There is probably a dozen or more different shades of olive drab dyes used to make much of this stuff.)

Each of the materials listed on the standard for use as the chest box strap will have a different appearance.
Most of the synthetic materials will have a shiny, reflective appearance, while cotton does not. Using a synthetic material instead of cotton will be a noticeable difference to what we see on screen.

A previously posted version of the standard did not even mention cotton as an option even though we know that cotton webbing was used for the film. The current version still does not mention that cotton is what was actually used for the film. It only lists cotton as one of the options that may be used on the chest box.

I may be wrong, but I believe that the LCJ's worded the standard this way to make it easier for people to get their costume finished and approved.

Making a change to the standard as you propose over such a minor detail would not make it easier. It would just complicate things.

David L.
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Jerrick Sunrunner (Mark Mulcaster)
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for your input,
I think that whilst the current standard is clear and easy to follow it also leads to too many variables. Take the flightsuits, the standards donít really go into the pocket placement or even an ideal suggestion of positioning.
It might be good to see examples of pocket placements made
Available as a link to the standards.
Most pilots probably buy their flightsuit and if what one judge tells
me is true that the pockets placements seem to be a big issue for a number of submissions shouldnít we either; push back on the vendors, or offer a better resource and information on where the pockets should be positioned?


When we look at the references for ANH the pocket placements are not consistent and yet the judges are asking the positions to be made more consistent.
Sorry I digress,

There isnít much explanation in the standards that either stipulate that the flare holders need to match the belt colour or be darker or lighter.
I agree that this costume standards needs to be open and easy to follow. So if I were to add an amendment I would only suggest itís optional.
I have a belt with as closer match (we could find) to both the material for the harness patterning and the herring bone fabric. The later was sourced from a street market, and so at least in the UK itís readily available in sensible amounts, cost about £5.

Whatís interesting to note in the higher res images is that you can see that the chest box is Velcro fastens round the top neck also.
The High-Res film also helps confirm that no X-Wing Pilot has blue
Commpad buttons and also that thereís a tonne of pilots who donít have their trousers tucked into the their boots.

Now Iím definitely not saying we need to account for all
thise variations but I think itís good and healthy to not only discuss the new costumes but revisit the older ones from time to time.

Iím also happy to be wrong or in the minority about this too Wink
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I completely agree that there needs to be more details added to the standards to rectify many (if not most) of the problems you mentioned.
Adding notes to the standard about the specifics of items or materials that were used on the film costumes would or could be very beneficial.
(As long as it doesn't make the task of collecting such items nearly impossible for finishing the costume.)

I can also understand the desire for the LCJ's to make things more consistent.
Having too many variations to keep track of can be a nightmare to deal with, and may place an undue burden on them.
I think it's a matter of finding a healthy balance all around.

Holding vendors accountable for precise placement of the pockets and other details only really works if they are tailor making the jumpsuits.
Making a one size and shape version jumpsuit (which is what most vendors offer) will not fit the same on everyone.

Making certain items to fit people is often just estimated guesswork based on the information that they give you.
Everyone is different and if the info that I receive is not entirely accurate, I cannot guarantee that it will fit them perfectly.

Some people have criticized my Endor Donut helmets for looking too large.
Being a hard item that will not stretch or conform in any way, I really do not want to make it too small. If I make it too small it is useless and a waste of money. So I often make it a little larger than needed just to make sure it will fit the buyer. Everyone's head is shaped differently, and when the buyer is thousands of miles away, I don't have a proper way to see how the helmet will fit them until after it is made and shipped.

Now if only body lazer scanners were as common as 3-D printers are today, the buyer could scan him or herself and email the file to the vendor to have the item made to fit perfectly.

David L.
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