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[New Standard] Temple Guard - The Clone Wars Version
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Oraculo (Agustín)
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:49 am    Post subject: [New Standard] Temple Guard - The Clone Wars Version Reply with quote

Hello everyone!

General debate for a new outfit for the KJO Detachment

Please have a look at the following costume standard proposal and post your thoughts, ideas, suggestions in this thread.

Initial discussion I'd like to set as two weeks, but I understand we may need longer, let's see how it goes

Temple Guard - The Clone Wars Version

Required Items:

1. Hood: Two toned billowed hood that passes inside the shoulder wrap and over the chest piece.

2. Mask: May be either a mask or full helmet as long as no visible edge is seen through the top/side of hood. It is a hard/reflective material with appropriate detail painted on. Costumer’s eyes should not be visible.

3. Balaclava: Of brown material in line with the rest of the costume. Bottom edge extends inside collar of shirt. Costumer’s skin/hair should not be visible.

4. Tabards: Light colored single tabard in the back beginning at the belt that forms a Y as it passes over the shoulders. Tabards cross in the front with the right tabard ending at the intersection and left tabard continuing to the belt. Tabards should extend past the natural shoulder point. Has appropriate designs applied to the front of the tabards.

5. Shoulder wrap: Light colored wrap that passes under the tabards and over the hood/chest piece. Piece should extend past tabards and natural shoulder to create a small cap. Has appropriate designs applied to the shoulders.

6. Chest: Light colored piece that begins at the belt in front and runs at least to the shoulder with a v-neck visible through the hood. Passes under the shoulder wrap/hood and over the shirt.

7. Shirt: Relatively form fitting shirt that has a high, overlapping collar. Collar and sleeves are a light color while the torso is a darker shade. No skin should be visible.

8. Bracers/hand plates: Heavy leather, or similar, bracers with two darker straps and attached darker hand plates.

9. Gloves: Lightweight gloves of similar color to shirt sleeve.

10. Belt: Heavy leather, or similar, main belt with a recess running down the middle and accurate metallic buckle. Thin leather, or similar, hangs below the belt on the back and sides with one shorter flap on either side. Bag and flap edges are trimmed in gold. There is a small pouch/flap that extends from the main belt in the middle of the back.

a. Keys: Twelve metallic keys hang from the belt on angular rings that attach under the main belt. There are two key designs that repeat in varying colors and orientations.

b. Saber clip: Metallic clip located on lower portion of the left side of the main belt. Accepts a button similar to covertec, but this is not a standard covertec belt clip.

11. Skirt: Dark ankle length skirt with an opening in front. Woven or quilted panel extends to just below the knee. Both main skirt and panel are trimmed in lighter fabric.

12. Pants: Dark brown fitted pants with no visible pockets/details.

13. Boots: Two tone boot that rises to just below the knee with a front extension to cover the kneecap. Kneecap/bracer, back of boot and toe of boot a lighter shade than the rest of the boot.

14. Saber: Temple Guard double bladed saber proportional to the costumer. If bladed, blades should be yellow.

IMPORTANT NOTE: The Temple Guard appears with two color schemes depending on lighting. Most scenes feature a cream/tan scheme, while the trial scene shows grey/brown. Either scheme is acceptable, however "light" and "dark" components of the costume must be consistent across the costume to maintain a suitable color palatte.

In general, “light” and “dark” shades should be consistent across pieces to maintain a suitable color palette.

There's alot of ref pics in the KJO Detachment Page

http://www.kjo.rebellegion.com/?portfolio=jedi-temple-guard-tcw

More information

http://www.forum.rebellegion.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=52416&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Thank you so much

Best Regards!
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Last edited by Oraculo (Agustín) on Mon Jun 13, 2016 6:55 pm; edited 5 times in total
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Oraculo (Agustín)
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2015 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Everyone!

Any suggestion, opinion or idea about this suit?

Best Regards! Wink
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Sair ()
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hiya!

This costume is high on my MUST DO list. Have done a fair bit of research on it too. It is rather complicated tricky and I have a few questions/clarifications to ask if that's okay?

First off, as the costume is made up of lots of piece and layers could we generate a simple diagram/picture of the outfit with labels showing which pieces are what (eg. which piece is the shoulder wrap compared to the chest piece? Would make matching the specific requirements to the individual pieces a bit easier.

1. Hood: Not sure what you mean by "passes inside the shoulder wrap and over the chest piece. Does that imply that the hood is a separate piece and is not attached/part of the under tunic? Not sure this is worded quite clearly enough.

2. Mask: Are we going to stipulate a finish for the gold patterns on the mask? Matt or satin or gloss finishes?

3. Balaclava: Agreed, no comment.

4. Tabards: Are we going to stipulate how the gold pattern is applied to the tabards? Use of fabric paint or with embroidery?

5. Shoulder wrap: Not sure that 'shoulder wrap' is the best description for this piece. The piece sits more like a cowl or yoke. Is the 'shoulder wrap' made of one piece or two? Is a seem allowed if it is hidden under the central Y tabard on the the back?

6. Chest piece: are you referring to the "T" shaped that sits under the tabards and the cowl? I disagree that you can see a V neck through the hood. In pic 27 it shows that you can't actually see the top of the chest plate. The 'shoulder/wrap"/cowl totally covers it. In my opinion.

7. Shirt/Inner Tunic: Would add that the IT has a V neck collar and that it is close fitting (not loose or baggy around the collar/chest or on the arms.

8. Bracers/hand plates: Technical name for this piece of armour is a vambrace. Perhaps change it if we want to be picky to Vambrace with hand plate. Is a visible join/seem allowed running lengthwise along the inner arm?

9. Gloves; Agree, no comment.

10. Belt. Q: to me I haven't actually been able to make out an actual bag. I can only see multiple layers of leather making a 'skirted obi' if you will. Could you point out any reference pics to the bags/pouches?

11. Skirt: Perhaps add cream or tan into the 'dark ankle length skirt' description. Obviously it isn't dark dark. Are we going to suggest matching the dark and light colours to those used in the tunic? They appear to be similar colours to me.

12. Pants: suggest mentioning that the pants are close fitting, not loose or flabby.

13. Boots: Can the two tone effect of the boots be created with paint or with additional fabric (applied to create the desired pattern and colour tones and contrasts). Do we want to stipulate if they are to be leather/pleather/suede or that they need to have a matt or gloss finish?

14. Saber: Agreed, no comment.

Thanks for your work on this. Hope these comments help.

Cheers, Sair
Tython Base, Australia
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Ixam Let'si (max)
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sair wrote:
Hiya!

This costume is high on my MUST DO list. Have done a fair bit of research on it too. It is rather complicated tricky and I have a few questions/clarifications to ask if that's okay?

First off, as the costume is made up of lots of piece and layers could we generate a simple diagram/picture of the outfit with labels showing which pieces are what (eg. which piece is the shoulder wrap compared to the chest piece? Would make matching the specific requirements to the individual pieces a bit easier.

6. Chest piece: are you referring to the "T" shaped that sits under the tabards and the cowl? I disagree that you can see a V neck through the hood. In pic 27 it shows that you can't actually see the top of the chest plate. The 'shoulder/wrap"/cowl totally covers it. In my opinion.


Thanks for your work on this. Hope these comments help.

Cheers, Sair
Tython Base, Australia


Great work Oraculo and Sair your details are really good and I agree on most of your points. I'm seriously adding this to my ever growing costume list.

I quoted the above point for the Chest area as there are references for the V neck mention. Picture no 27 does show no chest plate, however, picture 75 does show a v plus shows several layers IT, OT, plate and hood.
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Oraculo (Agustín)
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2015 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello everyone

Thank you Max Smile

Thank you for the contributions, Max and Sair. Now in a while I update the proposal with their suggestions and ideas.

We decided to give one more week of time to this thread general debate. Wink Wink

Best Regards!
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Ixam Let'si (max)
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Because there's a high level of detail i think a visual. Guide to each components will needed.

E.g wraps
Hood
Tunic
Etc
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rogue9607 (Nick)
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was just made aware of this thread... as the author of the proposed standard, it would've been nice to know that this was up for debate. If we're still discussing it, I can add a lot of insight into the individual components, as well as noting some potential revisions since I wrote this 5 months ago.
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Oraculo (Agustín)
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rogue9607 wrote:
I was just made aware of this thread... as the author of the proposed standard, it would've been nice to know that this was up for debate. If we're still discussing it, I can add a lot of insight into the individual components, as well as noting some potential revisions since I wrote this 5 months ago.


Hello Nick

No problem, the debate remains open. So if you want more information about this new suit, no problem.

We extend the debate a few weeks so that you can keep improving the standard

Best Regards! Wink Wink
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rogue9607 (Nick)
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sair wrote:
Hiya!

This costume is high on my MUST DO list. Have done a fair bit of research on it too. It is rather complicated tricky and I have a few questions/clarifications to ask if that's okay?

First off, as the costume is made up of lots of piece and layers could we generate a simple diagram/picture of the outfit with labels showing which pieces are what (eg. which piece is the shoulder wrap compared to the chest piece? Would make matching the specific requirements to the individual pieces a bit easier.


I'll work on a diagram like this.

Sair wrote:
1. Hood: Not sure what you mean by "passes inside the shoulder wrap and over the chest piece. Does that imply that the hood is a separate piece and is not attached/part of the under tunic? Not sure this is worded quite clearly enough.


It's unclear what the hood is attached to, but it's definitely not attached to the shirt/inner tunic. There are four costume pieces in that area other than the hood, and the hood passes over two of them and under two of them. The hood disappears between the shoulder wrap and the chest piece, which is what I was trying to convey.

Sair wrote:
2. Mask: Are we going to stipulate a finish for the gold patterns on the mask? Matt or satin or gloss finishes?


I personally feel that there's some slight reflectivity of mask, but it's not absolutely clear from reference. I feel there's some room for individual interpretation.

Sair wrote:
3. Balaclava: Agreed, no comment.

4. Tabards: Are we going to stipulate how the gold pattern is applied to the tabards? Use of fabric paint or with embroidery?


Again, I think this could be up to interpretation. Personally I feel the shoulder and upper tabard logos are painted while the lower logo is either painted or embroidered (though there's certainly not enough reference to require embroidery).

Sair wrote:
5. Shoulder wrap: Not sure that 'shoulder wrap' is the best description for this piece. The piece sits more like a cowl or yoke. Is the 'shoulder wrap' made of one piece or two? Is a seem allowed if it is hidden under the central Y tabard on the the back?


I'm open to other names. Smile Mine does have a seam at center back under the tabard. This piece will not sit right without a seam/darts.

Sair wrote:
6. Chest piece: are you referring to the "T" shaped that sits under the tabards and the cowl? I disagree that you can see a V neck through the hood. In pic 27 it shows that you can't actually see the top of the chest plate. The 'shoulder/wrap"/cowl totally covers it. In my opinion.


Yes, that's the piece that I'm referring to. Pic 45 shows the V-neck under the hood and over the wrapped collar of the shirt. My interpretation is that the v-neck seen here and the lower chest piece are the same rather than introduce yet another piece. Also note that color shades seem to change constantly with lighting/shadow. Even the sleeves/torso of the shirt appear to be the same color in one shot and different colors in another.

Sair wrote:
7. Shirt/Inner Tunic: Would add that the IT has a V neck collar and that it is close fitting (not loose or baggy around the collar/chest or on the arms.


I see no reference for an Inner Tunic, only the shirt. This is a single piece that has a high/wrapped neck. The V-neck is from the chest piece listed above

Sair wrote:
8. Bracers/hand plates: Technical name for this piece of armour is a vambrace. Perhaps change it if we want to be picky to Vambrace with hand plate. Is a visible join/seem allowed running lengthwise along the inner arm?


Sair wrote:
9. Gloves; Agree, no comment.

10. Belt. Q: to me I haven't actually been able to make out an actual bag. I can only see multiple layers of leather making a 'skirted obi' if you will. Could you point out any reference pics to the bags/pouches?


It makes sense if this lower hanging flap was a bag with flaps concealing an opening, though there would be no need to build it that way as long as it was visually accurate. Having said that, the line that mentions "bag" is one I'm going to suggest deleting since the gold edging is not consistent across reference.

Sair wrote:
11. Skirt: Perhaps add cream or tan into the 'dark ankle length skirt' description. Obviously it isn't dark dark. Are we going to suggest matching the dark and light colours to those used in the tunic? They appear to be similar colours to me.


There is a note that "light" and "dark" should be consistent across the costume. The issue is that the Temple Guard typically appears tan/cream except for the trial scene where it's grey/brown. My view is that the trial scene is the anomaly due to the lighting, but I could see either option being acceptable as long as the color choice is consistent. (probably should add some phrase to that point)

Sair wrote:
12. Pants: suggest mentioning that the pants are close fitting, not loose or flabby.


Agreed. "Fitted pant" would probably suffice.

Sair wrote:
13. Boots: Can the two tone effect of the boots be created with paint or with additional fabric (applied to create the desired pattern and colour tones and contrasts). Do we want to stipulate if they are to be leather/pleather/suede or that they need to have a matt or gloss finish?


I don't see the need to stipulate method of creation or material as long as the look is correct. And, as tough as boots are, I don't think I'd care about matte or gloss if everything else was appropriate, though high gloss would probably be distracting.

Sair wrote:
14. Saber: Agreed, no comment.

Thanks for your work on this. Hope these comments help.

Cheers, Sair
Tython Base, Australia


Thank you for your comments!
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rogue9607 (Nick)
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Short version of my last post with suggested changes:

10. Remove "Bag and flap edges are trimmed in gold." since the reference for this is not consistent. This detail seems to be consistent with the lighting effects on other parts of the costume.

12. Add "fitted" in front of the word "pants".

Replace note at bottom with "The Temple Guard appears with two color schemes depending on lighting. Most scenes feature a cream/tan scheme, while the trial scene shows grey/brown. Either scheme is acceptable, however "light" and "dark" components of the costume must be consistent across the costume to maintain a suitable color palatte.
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Sair ()
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2015 1:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks a lot for your replies Nick. Very happy with all your comments, I don't have a strong opinion about the areas for interlretation either but just thought I'd ask every question that I could think of to gain greater clarification.

Looking forward to seeing the final standards and having a go myself at some stage :-)

Cheers, Sair
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rogue9607 (Nick)
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2015 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rogue9607 wrote:
Replace note at bottom with "The Temple Guard appears with two color schemes depending on lighting. Most scenes feature a cream/tan scheme, while the trial scene shows grey/brown. Either scheme is acceptable, however "light" and "dark" components of the costume must be consistent across the costume to maintain a suitable color palette.


I've been thinking about this a bit and I'd appreciate other opinions. Originally I was thinking that both could be valid, but the more I think of it, the more the cream/tan scheme seems more appropriate. The artwork that was on starwars.com is absent from any scene lighting and shows the cream/tan coloration. The action figure, while not terribly useful for reference, also supports the tan/cream color.

Should we exclude the grey/brown scheme since this is presumably an artifact of that one room's lighting?
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2015 4:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rogue9607 wrote:

Should we exclude the grey/brown scheme since this is presumably an artifact of that one room's lighting?


I would think so, since we have pictures of the correct color from an LFL/Disney site.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2015 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I've always thought it to be more in the white/cream/bone/tan colour ration, not darker.
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Lora Skywalker ()
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2015 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm for going only cream/tan, since the other option is a lighting issue, imo. But colors should still coordinate, of course. Smile
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