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Obi-Wan in Mandalorian Armor... Approvable?
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Yeo Kero (Charles Wright)
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've thought about this for the last 24 hours or so, and I've come up with some pretty good points.
**********
Mando Obi vs Boushh/Leia:
1) Screentime. Obi-Wan in the episode is out of helmet for much much longer than Leia is. She's got about 2 minutes between taking off her helmet and being taken away at the most. Obi-Wan is most of the episode.

2) Introducing. Leia enters as Boushh, but you don't know until a few minutes later. She's bringing Chewie in on a chain, pulling out a thermal detonator and threatening everybody, and Jabba even calls her "his type of scum". In the episode, Obi-Wan is quite visibly himself and subduing the Mando for his armor. At no time is it hidden that he's not the bad guy.

3) Backstory. The factor remains that most of our Leias as Boushh troop helmet on most of the time (from the pictures I've seen) so how do you distinguish Leia from Boushh? If the stipulation is that Obi-Wan doesn't wear the Mando helmet and carries a lightsaber, at least there's the distinguishing marker.

**************
Obi-Wan vs Stormtrooper Luke/Han
1) Stormtroopers are indistinguishable from one another. Cookie Cutter armor as it were. Mandos generally make their armors distinct in their own way, the armor that Obi-Wan is wearing has specific markings.

2) Obi-Wan's face, hair style and beard is very recognizable to the Star Wars community, where as clean shaven Luke and Han could really just be stormtroopers without helmets (not to say there's probably not stormtroopers with beards...)

3) As Stormtroopers, Han and Luke are carrying around standard issue Imperial blasters. Not very distinguishing than that of other Stomtroopers. However, Obi-Wan is brandishing his very distinctive lightsaber. Very uncommon of a Mandalorian for starts, only one other Mando carries a lightsaber, and the blade is black.

***************
Mando Obi-Wan vs. Clone Obi-Wan

1) There are already standards for Obi-Wan in clone armor. With helmet on is a Formal requirement I believe and so is a lance, which could make someone who hasn't seen the microseries say "Why is that clone wearing a cape?" It's pretty much the same argument for "Why is that mando with the good guys?". I know that Clones are already acceptable with the Rebel Legion, but the premise is the same.

****************

Other Arguments:

Mando Mercs, as I gather it from members I know, do not allow Jedi at all, even face characters.
501st do not allow custom mandos, just Jango and Boba.

The argument "People won't get it, they see mando armor and think bad guy"? Who among us hasn't been mistaken as another character by someone who really doesn't know the movies all that well? Tie Pilots being called Darth Vader? A bearded Generic Jedi being called OBi-Wan? A X-Wing Pilot being called Luke? Yes, there are those who won't understand, haven't seen the episode, or just frankly don't know Star Wars at all. But, there will be people who DO get it, that HAVE seen the episode and KNOW Star Wars. I've trooped at A'Sharad Hett for two years, I've heard "Why is the sandperson carrying a lightsaber?" "Who's the Mummyguy?" "Why's Darth Vader wearing brown?", I can only count 2 times someone's gotten the character right while trooping, but it's those two times that make me do the "You the man!" gesture. I'm sure with some people, a short explanation is going to be required with this costume, as is most Clone Wars, EU, and minor/background characters. As long as the costume standard is done correctly, it could be an enjoyable costume that people will love seeing as well as trooping in.

"Lawless" Obi-Wan Kenobi (Season 5 Finale)
Required:
1. Mandalorian Deathwatch Supercommando Armor (no Helmet) in the accurate paint scheme (warn Red chest, back, neck and shoulder bell/warn Grey ab, forearm, handplates, cod, thigh, knee and shin)
2. Black flightsuit/jumpsuit
3. Black flakvest
4. Neckseal
5. Black gloves
6. Belt w/Deathwatch style pouches
7. Mandalorian style boots
8. Episode III Obi-Wan lightsaber (blade optional)
9. Hair and beard styled in Obi-Wan style (wigs and prosthetics allowed)

Optional:
Deathwatch style Jetpack
Dual pistols (holstered)
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

*if* this were to get the go ahead, as previously mentioned Obi Wan hair & beard & Obi Wan style lightsaber would have to be a MUST imho.
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Naglium (Gordon Gravelese)
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

_Master_Skywalker_ wrote:
*if* this were to get the go ahead, as previously mentioned Obi Wan hair & beard & Obi Wan style lightsaber would have to be a MUST imho.


Agreed.

So the question still remains... if this costume was submitted (and it looked awesome), *would* it be approved? There's a cadet in my base who would like to do this costume for RL membership, but doesn't want to spend the time or money on it if there's no chance of it being approved.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I personally would say this should be approved. It is much akin to Boussh.

Perhaps for RL approval, the helmet should be off?
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Yeo Kero (Charles Wright)
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've also got my resorces lined up to do this costume. I really really want to do it, but if I spend the money it takes and they say no...i got a nice halloween costume Razz
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, we have no standards as such. We'll accept it if he does as previously mentioned but it would be helpful to the legion if seeing as he's the first doing it if he would write up a detailed list of *proposed* standards & we'll get the costume committee to have a look at it.

I still find it disturbing we can accept Mandalorian armour into the Rebel Legion but we cannot accept mechanical R2's but that is another debate entirely.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've recently submitted a 501st CRL for this character:



Structurally, its the same as Obi-Wan with the following changes:
-Different paint job / color scheme
-No horns on helmet or shoulder armor
-Add Obi-Wan hair and beard
-Add Obi-Wan lightsaber
-Helmet considered optional (informal).

I can re-tool my writeup for the Mandalorian Supercommando Captain and edit it for Obi-Wan in Mando armor, if you would like.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like a plan
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry it took so long. had a busy couple of days at work















Helmet:
-Animated Style required.
-Ear caps are symmetrical, with no range finder.
-Hemet is black, with white cheek areas, red mandibles, red band at brow level that goes around the entire helmet, and 4 red “horns” painted on the dome to match the visual reference.
-Helmet should have a black visor, with the wearer’s face not easily visible

Flightsuit:
-Black in color.
-Has traditional Mandalorian style double sleeves.
-No pockets should be visible.

Vest
-Black leather heavy cloth-like like vest
-Shoulders should flare outward like wings
-“Jango Style” vest is preferred
-Bottom of vest should end just after the bottom of the chest / back armor, and not be tucked into the girth belt, to allow for some flightsuit to show.
-Black Neckseal may or may not be attached to the vest

Chest armor
-Consists of collar armor, left and right breast plates, a center diamond, and an abdominal plate.
-Must be made of a solid material such as fiberglass, styrene or sintra.
-Must have dimension and give the feeling of thickness and depth
-The collar, center diamond, left, and right chest pieces are red with light grey weathering
-The abdominal plate is painted light grey with red weathering.
-The left breast plate must have two indented horizontal bars, painted to match the color scheme of the rest of the plate.
-The center diamond plate between breast plates must have a raised vertical rectangle as shown in the visual reference.
-All pieces must attach securely to the vest.

Shoulder Armor
-Must have dimension and give the feeling of thickness and depth.
-Shoulder armor is red.
-Shoulder armor should flare out off the shoulders to present a wider than normal silhouette.

Gauntlets
-Gauntlet color is charcoal grey.
-Gauntlets taper towards the wrist.
-Gauntlets have a seam on the inside of the arm with indents on either side of the seam as shown.
-Gauntlets have a stepped detail on the top center as shown.
-Left gauntlet has a Mandalorian compad attached on the top, near the wrist.

Gloves
-Black over the wrist gloves made of leather, nylon, or other low pile fabrics. Gloves must not show any labels or logos once the armor is on and cover any exposed skin.

Handplates
-Must have dimension and give the feeling of thickness and depth.
-Symmetrical, angled tombstone shaped handplates.
-Color is charcoal grey.

Backplate
-Must have dimension and give the feeling of thickness and depth.
-Color is charcoal grey, with red near the top.
-Collar and backplate do not overlap.

Girth belt
-Black leather or leather-like material.
-6" to 8” tall depending on the height of the wearer.

Segmented Belt
-Segmented belt worn outside of the girth belt.
-Plate size/positioning must match the visual reference.
-All belt segments are 3 inches tall
-Front center segment is 1.5 inches, with a 1 in x ½ in section removed from the center.
-Moving out from the middle on either sides are as follows: ¼ inch, 1 inch, ½ inch. Then, 3 inch pieces are repeated until the wearer’s side. The two pieces on the wearer’s left and right hip are 3 inch pieces, with a 1 inch by 1 inch removed from the center.
-Back half of the belt contain 3 pieces. There is a 3 inch segment in the center of the back, and the remaining length (from the right hip to the back center, and from the left hip to the back center) are solid pieces.
-Color is charcoal grey.

Codpiece
-Must have dimension and give the feeling of thickness and depth.
-Triangular cod piece with rounded bottom edge.
-Color is grey to match the helmet and armor.

Thigh armor and holsters
-Must have dimension and give the feeling of thickness and depth.
-Wraps around the outer thigh.
-Holsters are integrated with the armor.
-Must have no visible straps / attachment.
-Color is black

Knee armor
-Must have dimension and give the feeling of thickness and depth.
-Color is charcoal black
-Must attach securely to the front of the knees over the flightsuit with no straps or visible means of attachment.

Shin armor
-Must have dimension and give the feeling of thickness and depth.
-Color is grey to match the cod piece/gauntlets etc.

Boots
-Black boots with black soles and toe covering.
-Palladium boots Pampa Hi in black canvas are an example of acceptable style.

Boot armor
-Must have dimension and give the feeling of thickness and depth.
-Color is black.
-Boot armor covers the top of the foot, hiding laces if present.
-Boot armor must connect with no visible means of attachment.

Jetpack
-Animated style sculpt required.
-Paint scheme to match the visual reference.

Mandalorian Pistols
-Animated style pistols to fit in thigh holsters.
-Painted in silver and gunmetal grey to match the visual references.

Hair
-Facial hair should be a full beard
-Hair parted on the left, and styled like Obi-Wan
-Color to closely match visual reference

Lightsaber
-Epi 3 Saber with blue blade
-Hung from belt, or carried
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Last edited by Naglium (Gordon Gravelese) on Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:25 am; edited 1 time in total
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Furiafelina (Ineabelle Rodriguez)
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Really? 501 won't accept it?

Well I thought they would accept anything in armor.
I had that impression, precisely because they accepted Boushh.
There was this argument once about the clone troopers phase1 that because they were predecessors to stormtroopers, blah blah... I figured Mando armor would be the same case.

Now I am confused.

Naglium wrote:
_Master_Skywalker_ wrote:
I agree with Furiafelina, Luke in stormtrooper would be helmetless to but that is not approvable either. By all means make the costume and have fun, but I agree it does not appear to be a Rebel Legion costume.As stated there are other groups it would fit with.


The 501st wouldn't accept it, as they see it as "Obi Wan".

How is this any different than Leia in her Boush?

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That was only an assumption. I can double-check if you would like? Maybe they'll accept the "helmeted" character, but not the "bucket-off" version. I just don't see it as a reality.

After re-reading my write up, i realized I forgot the hair / beard / saber. OOPS!!!
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ALMO is onto this now, so we'll get it moved through soon, but yes, of course the hair, beard & saber is critical to this costume *lol*
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks. I updated my post to add the hair/beard/saber.

Please let me know if there's anything else you need from me. Smile
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SithariRog (Roger Allen)
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've reviewed the threads on this costume.

I, too, have no problem with this being a RL costume PROVIDED, there is the hair, mustache, beard and lightsaber (which are already added to the OP). There should not be a bucket "allowed" with this costume. I believe I would even insist a bucket not even be an optional item (or even listed)...because, with bucket on, this is a Mando costume (and, therefore, not a RL costume).

Costume standards (both those being updated and newly written standards) go through a protocol for submission to the RL.

I'll be adding this one to my cue and will work on it "soon"...mostly in formatting and seeing if anything jumps out at me that might be a problem. I would say...since there's already been a fair amount of discussion, we can minimize the time on the costume standard review.

So...once I get things formatted, anyone can use the costume standard as a starting point to begin costume fabrication. But remember...the absolute best "costume standard" isn't what is written, it is the image from the source material. If the costume looked exactly like that seen in the episode referenced, then it should be okay Wink
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh...and, this shoudl be moved to the Jedi forums, specifically under the OWK subforums, since this will be one of OWK's costumes.
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