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Leia's joining the Picnic (a.k.a Vera's Meadow Gown Build)
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Mieal Deneb (Rachel Orange)
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's what is driving me crazy, because any organza I find seems too sheer and doesn't have the crinkle, but "Dressing A Galaxy" says:

"The bodice
(corset) is worn over an old-gold silk organza blouse with mulitcolored ribbon detail around the lower sleeves." page 176 of the non-limited edition.

I found a nice gold crinkle fabric, I think a poly, but it isn't sheer at all. I wonder if I could get away with that?
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If my memory serves me well, the fabric was discussed in a wonderful “picnic” thread on theforce.net as well as on padawansguide. Though Dressing the Galaxy says it’s organza, it truth it is crinkled silk chiffon. It is believed to be one of mistakes in the book. You can look though picnic page on padawansguide and have a look at hi-res pictures from exhibitions that show the fabric really well! And it shouldn’t be seen through. Just a little bit, to make pink and yellow spots on the underskirt be barely seen. Ah… I’m not sure my explanation is clear.
So I won’t be too worried about the sheerness of that poly fabric in your place if its colour is right.


Last edited by Sothis () on Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:45 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaG contains MANY errors; calling this fabric 'organza' is just one of them. Seriously. There is no organza (or at least silk organza, that is) that would crinkle like this. The twisting of the threads and the silk gumming would totally prevent this. And unlike with some weaves, you can't just "make" it crinkle by washing it.

Sothis is right, the correct fabric to use would be crinkle silk chiffon.

A word of advice: crinkle silk chiffon will shrink like mad when washed (up to 20% in length and width!). The water causes the fibers to pucker up. The crinkle will become more 'full' after being washed.
So order 20% more fabric than you will need and wash it in the washing machine with silk washing detergent or silicone-free hair shampoo before you start to cut and sew. That way you'll have a nice, full crinkle AND can wash the garments after sewing them instead of having to dry clean, which is ALWAYS a pro.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, that's really stinkish if DAG has that many errors. Razz It was driving me nuts with it saying organza and all I know of organza NOT looking like that! I just figured I was no textile expert so what do I know... Rolling Eyes

Nice to know I wasn't going nuts after all.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mieal Deneb wrote:
Well, that's really stinkish if DAG has that many errors. Razz

It does.
When I compared the Red Invasion gown to its description in DaG, I came to the conclusion that said description was definitely written by someone who never saw that costume in person (let alone worked on it) and / or who has absolutely no idea about fibers and weaves - DaG doesn't get the fiber content, the weave or the number of panels in the dress right.
The description of that very same costume from the official website was off in the very same way; making me think that the same person (or someone with a similar "non-skill" level wrote both descriptions in DaG and on the official website.
Which I found highly amusing - you'd think that with a dress that cost $60,000 to make, *someone* who actually knows how or with which materials it was made would have been asked about it for the website and book Rolling Eyes

Quote:
Nice to know I wasn't going nuts after all.


You weren't, don't worry Smile
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naergi wrote:
Which I found highly amusing - you'd think that with a dress that cost $60,000 to make, *someone* who actually knows how or with which materials it was made would have been asked about it for the website and book Rolling Eyes


Amusing but also kinda sad. Another reason why I think we are so fortunate to have this wonderful community for gathering and sharing information. This is the kind of thing that is almost impossible to find in books so I really appreciate you sharing.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, it IS sad. But it can't be helped.

By the way, it seems I'm sadly derailing this thread, so back to topic - about the Picnic dress - two things I'd like to add - I'm pretty sure many people here have figured this out already, but just for the records....

First, you can clearly see (well ALMOST it you know "how"...) how the crinkle chiffon skirt has been cut; meaning what exactly the pattern shape of the skirt looks like.
If you look at the exhibit pictures on Padawansguide - one of the pictures this can be seen in is the fifth of Freya's pics; look at the hi res version of that one - you'll see that the crinkle of the chiffon runs horizontally at the center of the image, but becomes more and more vertical towards the sides of the image.
There are no seams at the front that indicate that this would be more than one pattern piece of fabric "while" said directional change in the crinkle "happens".
The crinkle on silk chiffon always runs railroaded down the bolt of the fabric, meaning it's parallel to the selvage edge.
Now, the only pattern piece shape that would allow for such a directional change would be this....:



The "crinkle direction" indicates the 'length-wise" crinkle, meaning the arrow in the picture would be parallel to the selvages of your fabric (and conclusively parallel to the pleats of the crinkle).
You can see how the direction of the crinkle would change from horizontal to vertical towards the sides if the skirt is hanging down from the waist.

There MAY be seams at the side which are not drawn into this pattern layout.
I couldn't see that in the exhibit pictures but since crinkle silk chiffon is usually sold in widths of 42-45 inches, you wouldn't be able to place a full circle skirt on the width of the fabric. So instead of a full circle, you'd cut out two half circles (basically front and back of the skirt) and sew them together so the seams are placed at the sides of the skirt.

Note that before you hem the skirt, let it hang out by the waistband for a couple of days.
Since that skirt is partially cut on the bias (between front/back and sides), there WILL be a lot of stretching in those places over time.
So you want to give the skirt that time to stretch because otherwise I can guarantee that your skirt will "grow" in length if you hem it right away without allowing it to stretch by itself.

Second, I've found this interesting tutorial about how to imitate a chain stitch (such as was used to decorate the skirt!) with a sewing machine.
Now, that can be done much easier than manually having to cross the thread in front of the needle every stitch or so - buy a "hair twister machine" (google that!), but instead of having it twist hair... have it twist your embroidery thread in front of the sewing machine needle Wink

Hope that this will be helpful for some people who make this dress - personally I always wanted a blue version of this one (and actually have a few yards of the embroidered cape netting in blue), but slowly but surely I feel to old to make and wear it. Wink
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Leia (Vera Campbell)
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you thank you THANK YOU for the link about the chain stitching! That is my biggest hold up on the skirt (besides waiting for possible tax refund to order all my fabrics). I don't want to settle for the stitches built in my machine and was considering doing the whole thing by hand. I'm also toying with the idea of starching the skirt fabric to make it easier to work with when I'm sewing on the vining. You've saved me, Naergi Smile

I think I've read elsewhere that a few people used a circle-and-a-half or two full circles.

Also, you might find it interesting, I came across a blue version of the shawl fabric in LA, blue roses on white netting that I bought and stashed for if I ever get married, I'd make not quite a replica, but based on it in blue and white Smile (now I just hope I actually get married one day so I can make it Wink )
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Naergi ()
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leia wrote:
Thank you thank you THANK YOU for the link about the chain stitching! That is my biggest hold up on the skirt (besides waiting for possible tax refund to order all my fabrics). I don't want to settle for the stitches built in my machine and was considering doing the whole thing by hand. I'm also toying with the idea of starching the skirt fabric to make it easier to work with when I'm sewing on the vining. You've saved me, Naergi Smile


Why, you're welcome ;-)

Coming to think of it, instead of twisting the you could also crochet a single row of those vines (since basically chain stitching is nothing else but crocheting a single row; just that it's done through the fabric...), then use a ribbon foot to sew that single crocheted row of decorative embroidery thread on using a monofilament thread which will become virtually invisible.

Quote:
I think I've read elsewhere that a few people used a circle-and-a-half or two full circles.


All in all, you need two full circles to achieve the look of the original skirt:
The outer full skirt is the 'golden' crinkle chiffon with the vines, and the 'inner' full skirt is the white-pink stained second inner layer (which can be seen very clearly in the fifth and the last "try on" pic at the bottom of Padawansguide's picnic exhibit page.

Quote:
Also, you might find it interesting, I came across a blue version of the shawl fabric in LA, blue roses on white netting that I bought and stashed for if I ever get married, I'd make not quite a replica, but based on it in blue and white Smile (now I just hope I actually get married one day so I can make it Wink )


*Hehe!*
Mine looks like this - grey netting, embroidered with white and blue roses / vines:

I've also digitized the corset embroideries for my embroidery machine - here is what they would look like in blue.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Faking the chain stitching by machine is interesting. I'll have to decide (when it comes time...whenever that is!) which way to do mine, by hand or this method. Thanks for sharing the link.

Does anyone know if Walmart still carries that shower curtain? I can't find anything like it. Sad
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a very educational thread! I'm halfway collecting materials for this one (picked up a bag of accurate sequins from someone on TFN, I stumbled across accurate shawl netting in the fashion district and now the guys at that store are starting to remember me as the girl who comes in for Star Wars costumes, since that store also stocks accurate flame velvet), and though I have no plans to do it in the near future, I'm definitely taking notes. Mr. Green
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Leia (Vera Campbell)
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naergi wrote:

Coming to think of it, instead of twisting the you could also crochet a single row of those vines (since basically chain stitching is nothing else but crocheting a single row; just that it's done through the fabric...), then use a ribbon foot to sew that single crocheted row of decorative embroidery thread on using a monofilament thread which will become virtually invisible.


Given how broken up the design is, that might be more trouble than it's worth!
I'm currently doing samples, I've drawn up a small pattern and I've hand-chained the first one and timed it, and tomorrow I'm going to try the machine method and time that one. I'll do a sample of anything that occurs to us to see which looks best and is possibly most efficient for time.

Quote:
*Hehe!*
Mine looks like this - grey netting, embroidered with white and blue roses / vines


Mine looks pretty similar Smile



[/quote]I've also digitized the corset embroideries for my embroidery machine - here is what they would look like in blue.[/quote]

Oooh, nice! I have access to embroidery machines and software, but I'm still a novice at the software so for now I plan to hand-stitch the corset, but I hope to learn enough to digitize the flowers on the skirt, and that'll cut some of the time down.
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Leia (Vera Campbell)
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mieal Deneb wrote:
Faking the chain stitching by machine is interesting. I'll have to decide (when it comes time...whenever that is!) which way to do mine, by hand or this method. Thanks for sharing the link.

Does anyone know if Walmart still carries that shower curtain? I can't find anything like it. Sad


I haven't looked, but I doubt it... that pattern was real popular the year Ep II came out and I haven't seen it since. Kicking myself for not getting that one, I didn't know about it at the time.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leia wrote:
Mieal Deneb wrote:
...

Does anyone know if Walmart still carries that shower curtain? I can't find anything like it. Sad


I haven't looked, but I doubt it... that pattern was real popular the year Ep II came out and I haven't seen it since. Kicking myself for not getting that one, I didn't know about it at the time.



At the time, I didn't think I'd want to take on anything that detailed...ha! Here I am up to my neck in the Ep2 cut scene senate gown with all that beading and silk velvet...(yeah, I haven't worked on it in a LONG time, but I'm picking it back up again to hopefully finally finish it!)
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Leia (Vera Campbell)
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mieal Deneb wrote:
At the time, I didn't think I'd want to take on anything that detailed...ha! Here I am up to my neck in the Ep2 cut scene senate gown with all that beading and silk velvet...(yeah, I haven't worked on it in a LONG time, but I'm picking it back up again to hopefully finally finish it!)


I am SOOO glad you're picking this up again!
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