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Anakin/Obiwan @ AOTC arena -- standards?
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Cobalt60
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 4:29 am    Post subject: Anakin/Obiwan @ AOTC arena -- standards? Reply with quote

in the AOTC arena scene, Anakin and Obiwan have no belt pouches, food caps, nor covertec clips.
all of their gadgetry has been confiscated. this continues for ~ 1/4 of the film,
until after they fight dooku.

for a time, in the arena, they each wear a single shackle on one wrist -- but these shackles are gone when they fight dooku.

for anakin, I believe the standards address "AOTC arena lightsaber hilt" as an optional item..
..but the standards still require pouches/capsules/covertec as "Required" items,
when these characters wore none of these things on their costume for a good portion of the film.



--> should the standards reflect the costume change in AOTC?
((we've got seperate standards for "post trash compactor" Luke&Han in ANH, for example --
-- perhaps we need "dooku fight scene" or "post AOTC arena" for anakin and obiwan,
where the pouches/capsules/covertec are simply not mentioned))?

--> in lieu of this, should the various pouches and belt tools be changed to "optional items" for these 2 costumes, in the current standards?
(as these 2 characters carried NO pouches/covertecs/foodcaps for at least 1/4 of the film -- it seems odd that these are "Required" items -- shouldn't they be "optional")?


Razz

-=discuss=-
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padme911 (Becca K)
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anakin wore at least one of his pouches even here: (copy and paste it as it only works that way)http://disparue.org/gallery/4/movies/starwars/2/images/starwars2_3368.jpg

I do see Obi-Wan with out them but I am not sure it warrants a separate standard especially since this would encourage someone to get in without pouches and such which really are hallmarks of the costume. These are face character costumes and we are a bit harder on them.
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Masterbean (Brian Bean)
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know how it would encourage anyone to "get away" with anything.
Getting a battle arena saber is going to be more difficult than anything else in that costume. So if our focus is on keeping face character standards "hard" (and I really hope that's not the case) this shouldn't be an issue.
However, I do believe that this costume would only have requirements and not optional pieces. As you really would need the restraints on a wrist, lack of pouches and capsules and the alternate saber to show that you're doing that specific scene.
Really, the majority of costumers pick the scene/costume they want to do then worry about the standards.
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ladyb (Brita Capell)
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While they did have their gear stripped I would still have it in the standards. If someone was staging a Duel with Dooku I think it would be fine to be without, but they should probably have the whole costume for approval purposes.
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Aurabesh
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO this is not something we really need to deal with right now. It's not a costume that a lot of people will be doing, and because of that does not really need standards atm.

If someone does do either of these costumes; then the that person will be the one to write them. We are talking about minor differences in how the pre battle and post battle costumes look; that I just don't see a need to write up separate standards for them.
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padme911 (Becca K)
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The big difference in the Post Trash Compactor Luke and Han and AOTC Battle Anakin and Obi-Wan are that Luke and Han have things added to their costumes that they do not normally have(stormtrooper belt) where as Anakin and Obi-Wan had those things originally but they were taken away by the enemy but they still had them originally so the characters technically should have the pouches, food caps and covertec clip but they were taken away. Luke and Han added things and if they want to show that variant, they still should have the pouches, food caps and covertec clip.
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Cobalt60
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the standards, as written, (seem to) apply to the entire movie;
in that sense, its odd that these would be required items, when they were not present for the entire movie.*

if you are saying that the individual costumer should 'own' the items, even if they don't ever intend to wear them as part of a screen accurate ensemble, then that (seems to) place a cart before the horse.
((as per.. whats more important? screen accurate? or formal acceptance?))




* on this note: what exactly constitutes "optional" vs. "required", btw? is there a criteria?

I would think, that IF the item was present as part of the costume for the entire film (such as tabbards or undertunic) then it should be "required";
but IF the item is only worn occasionally, and is not always present (like a wool robe), then it should be optional.

in that sense,, shouldn't the food caps and belt tools be "optional" items, in the SAME context as the Jedi Robe? they were not always worn in this movie.

-========-

note: in the TPM standards for Obiwan , the food caps ARE in the same category as the jedi robe;
BUT.. obiwan wore food caps in every scene (!) unlike his robe.

by contrast: in the AOTC standards for obiwan, the food caps are NOT in the same category as the robe;
BUT.. obiwan did NOT wear food caps in every scene. (he wore them less than he did the robe).

---> shouldn't the food caps for AOTC be in the same category as the jedi robe? as they are for TPM?

((and/or --> shouldn't the food caps be "required" for TPM? as they are for AOTC?))

there seems to be some confusion there. Confused these standards seem to contradict each other;
why are the food caps and belt tools considered to be "less" of a requirement for TPM.. than they are for AOTC?
(when these items WERE present in every scene for TPM; but NOT for AOTC?)


Last edited by Cobalt60 on Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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padme911 (Becca K)
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am in the process of revising all standards and these Jedi ones will be rewritten but will not include costumes for different scenes since it is just a variation in costume. The AOTC Anakin Refugee costume is one that is in fact significantly different from his normal Jedi attire(as he is in hiding). Also, we do not have a standard for Qui-Gon with the poncho as he wears this for about 1/4 of TPM but it is only really over top of his Jedi gear. We do not need different standards for every scene in the movies with the Jedi since for the most part, the costume is standard. Other categories are different such as Padme who wears completely different costumes even just about every scene.
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Cobalt60
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess what I'm asking is..

why are food caps required for AOTC but optional for TPM ?


Last edited by Cobalt60 on Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:53 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Aurabesh
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ryan,

The LMO has clearly stated her decision on this. Why are you pushing so hard? once the LMO has decided on something; that needs to be the end of it.
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Cobalt60
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the question remains unanswered.. that happens a lot when I don't phrase things properly. Razz
at the risk of being misunderstood I thought I would.. re-articulate.

no offense intended.


Last edited by Cobalt60 on Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:55 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Aurabesh
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, well a decision has been made, and this needs to be brought to a close.
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Mastershane (Shane Gordon)
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would think they should still be required. Robes are optional because the Jedi wearing it can choose to wear it or not, whereas in AOTC the Jedi did not choose to not wear these items, they were removed by the enemy. I'm sure if they had not had them removed by the enemy, they would have worn them had they been given the option.
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Masterbean (Brian Bean)
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well, don't try to compare one set of standards to the other. Typically the standards are not all written by one person. There are many inconsistencies and it appears there are attempts to normalize them to some extent.
I can see both sides how battle arena outfits are different enough they could be their own category. But on the other side since the majority of the costume is there, there's really no need.
Also, I don't subscribe to the idea that just because the LMO says one thing discussion should be stopped. Many people have opinions and should be given the opportunity to state them.
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Leia (Vera Campbell)
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 5:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I say why worry about it unless someone actually expresses interest in doing it, because it's not necessarily a different enough variation? My personal opinion? Maybe have a little requirements addendum on the original standards for "Arena Version" that requires only the pounches seen during the scene, but must have the proper shackles and replacement lightsabers, AND have an approved formal version of the full Anakin/Obi-Wan costume before doing the variation.

My two credits, anyway Wink It doesn't seem like a drastic enough costume change, only a couple prop switches. It's not like anyone is itching to do 'arena version' for a LFL Event and absolutely needs a formal on it.
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