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Zuckuss: A Rebel Legion Costume?
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Mithras ()
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 8:00 am    Post subject: Zuckuss: A Rebel Legion Costume? Reply with quote

Perhaps this something Matt can weigh in on.

I was thinking about this today and thought I'd throw this out there. While the Bounty Hunters seen in ESB were hired to track down Luke, Zuckuss has been established in canon as a Rebel Sympathizer, and eventually, a Rebel agent (Expanded Universe says so, anyway.) Would Zuckuss be an approvable costume for the RL as such?

I certainly think it's a pretty nifty costume and a fascinating character, but I understand that this is a very grey area.

Just a thought.

-Alex
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 9:29 am    Post subject: Re: Zuckuss: A Rebel Legion Costume? Reply with quote

Mithras wrote:
Perhaps this something Matt can weigh in on.

I was thinking about this today and thought I'd throw this out there. While the Bounty Hunters seen in ESB were hired to track down Luke, Zuckuss has been established in canon as a Rebel Sympathizer, and eventually, a Rebel agent (Expanded Universe says so, anyway.) Would Zuckuss be an approvable costume for the RL as such?

I certainly think it's a pretty nifty costume and a fascinating character, but I understand that this is a very grey area.

Just a thought.

-Alex


Hi,

I think, it is same as with Boba Fett ... even he did some "good jobs", he is is still considered more as "bad guy" character ... Smile

BUT ... decision if Zuckuss is approvable in RL or not, is up to LMO Wink ...
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Reaper (Ed)
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zuckuss used to be a definate cross membership costume, due to the expansion of his character in the EU. He actively worked for the Rebel Alliance. thus a good guy.

But this wouldn't be the first thing to change.
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GotWookiee (Matt Pfingsten)
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zuckuss has never been a cross membership costume, Ed. There has never ever been a Zuckuss in the RL.
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ensamble (victor teran)
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

time for zuckuss
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ensamble (victor teran)
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

time that there would be a zuckuss

http://www.rebellegion.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42677
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks awesome. I guess if the EU says he is a good guy then he has to be in. Best to check with the Fringe LCJ's and the LMO about it.
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ensamble (victor teran)
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okey thank you
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Reaper (Ed)
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

we didn't have one, but it was a costume we would have approved. I know cause I lead that discussion. It was a what if discussion on the some characters.

I believe at the time of this discussion the 501st didn't have an Zuckuss costumers eiither.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah.
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theeviltwin ()
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GotWookiee wrote:
Looks awesome. I guess if the EU says he is a good guy then he has to be in. Best to check with the Fringe LCJ's and the LMO about it.


Whether it was discussed in the past or not, I believe the LMO makes the call on this. Sure the LCJs can make a pitch to the LMO, but so should the relevant detachment(s) command staff (representing the detachment membership) and anyone else who believes they have relevant information to share. The LMO considers that along with their own expertise, then makes their decision.

My pitch would be that Fringe costumes should be defined as those morally ambiguous / neutral characters in the story, living on the fringe of the conflict, who when are challenged to pick a side, chose to look beyond their own self interests and become heros.

Han, Lando, Mirax, etc. They may not start as the selfless heros they become, but they don't start as bad guys either.

There is nothing ambiguous or neutral about Zuckuss at the start - he is a bad guy, a bounty hunter willing to send good people (the crew of the Falcon) to a bad end (Vader) for his own self interests. In the EU Zuckuss may then align with the Alliance, but he was definitely a bad guy before that. Nothing proves that more than his one, mega iconic appearance in the SW saga.

One of my pet hates for the majority of the EU is the ridiculous idiotic morals that permeate the EU characters' mentalities. Bad guys do not stop being bad guys and become good guys by doing some good deeds. You don't stop being a convicted criminal when your jail sentence comes to an end. You can't commit mass murder, kidnap and detain innocents, carry out illegal assassinations or commit war crimes then be absolved by joining a mystical cult. Following the dark side then choosing to stop does not make you innocent on the grounds of diminished responsibility. Grrrrr!

The other issue with Zuckuss is that he only seems to have one costume. I did some searching when I was doing some research on Zuckuss and he only seems to have one set of clothes. The result is that when costuming, you will always look like Zuckuss: one of the classic iconic bad guy bounty hunters in league with the bad guys in Empire Strikes Back. If he ever changed his clothes (with enough references) then there would be a "good guy" Zuckuss costume. But I couldn't find one.

Ultimately I want to see this costume done, whatever the group it falls under. I've costumed with people in Zuckuss costumes and they are awesome. I'd pitch that Zuckuss should not be a RL costume. If it is allowed though, I'd pitch that it is a Fringe costume over other categories. If it was allowed and decided to be a Fringe costume my opinions here would be irrelevant when carrying out my LCJ duties and I would of course respect my responsibilities. And I'd be pleased to do so - it will always be a very cool costume and character.
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Nickel (Nick Letcher)
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

theeviltwin wrote:


My pitch would be that Fringe costumes should be defined as those morally ambiguous / neutral characters in the story, living on the fringe of the conflict, who when are challenged to pick a side, chose to look beyond their own self interests and become heros.

Han, Lando, Mirax, etc. They may not start as the selfless heros they become, but they don't start as bad guys either.

There is nothing ambiguous or neutral about Zuckuss at the start - he is a bad guy, a bounty hunter willing to send good people (the crew of the Falcon) to a bad end (Vader) for his own self interests. In the EU Zuckuss may then align with the Alliance, but he was definitely a bad guy before that. Nothing proves that more than his one, mega iconic appearance in the SW saga.


Bounty Hunters are morally ambiguous. They will work for whoever pays the best.

Jawas and Tuskens are "bad guys" on screen but are neutral characters in canon. They are eligible for dual membership in the RL and 501st. Zuckuss is clearly aligned with the Rebellion in the EU. He should be an approved costume.
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theeviltwin ()
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nickel wrote:
theeviltwin wrote:


My pitch would be that Fringe costumes should be defined as those morally ambiguous / neutral characters in the story, living on the fringe of the conflict, who when are challenged to pick a side, chose to look beyond their own self interests and become heros.

Han, Lando, Mirax, etc. They may not start as the selfless heros they become, but they don't start as bad guys either.

There is nothing ambiguous or neutral about Zuckuss at the start - he is a bad guy, a bounty hunter willing to send good people (the crew of the Falcon) to a bad end (Vader) for his own self interests. In the EU Zuckuss may then align with the Alliance, but he was definitely a bad guy before that. Nothing proves that more than his one, mega iconic appearance in the SW saga.


Bounty Hunters are morally ambiguous. They will work for whoever pays the best.

Jawas and Tuskens are "bad guys" on screen but are neutral characters in canon. They are eligible for dual membership in the RL and 501st. Zuckuss is clearly aligned with the Rebellion in the EU. He should be an approved costume.


The bounty hunting profession may be morally ambiguous but the individual bounty hunters themselves are not morally ambiguous. Each bounty hunters' (including Zuckuss) morals (or lack of) are expressed by their actions, eg. the prey they choose. Those whose moral code dictates they only hunt criminals / bad people display one moral code. Those who will hunt down the goodies - as long as they are being paid - display other morals.

There are a few bounty hunters in the SW EU whose morals dictate that they do not just work for whoever pays the best but follow their bounty hunting path based on their morals as well.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the movie, we only See Zuckuss Accepting a job from Vader. We do not see him committing any sort of evil act, simply replaying to a paying Job. In the EU we see him helping to evacuate Hoth Survivors, and then going to on actively support the Rebellion.

Where is the difference in the actions we see Zuckess doing then what Mara Jade did? other then Mara being an entirely EU character?

Zuckuss (and 4-LOM, his partner) commited no Evil acts other then responding to Vader's Bounty offer.

And as pointed out, Sandpeople are seen onscreen actively trying to kill a Hero of the series. but they are duel member costumes.
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JediMasterMark (Mark Jones)
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm actually okay with an accurate Zuckuss being brought into the Legion. There is enough documentation and sources to show where he worked for the Rebels as well as the Empire, including the Essential Guide to Characters, which shows where he was assigned to rescue Han before he was delivered to Jabba. We have enough dual sided characters (Clones, Anakin, etc.) that he could find a place here easily.

Naturally, whomever turns in the first one has best plan a standard along with it. Wink
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